off plan purchase at crystal spa aparthotel - eurosilex

[livenow]

how can we be sure that the banks are actually insisting on Eurosilex obtaining this clause from clients ? It doesnt feel correct to me. More like Eurosilex trying to somehow get us to give up our claims in case of non performance of contract.
Maybe they should invite us investors to the meeting with their banks

 

[dannyo]

hi all
well i have not looked at the posts for a few hours and i see we have more investors on line ,great and i see younew guys have being busy emailing eurosilex and from the tone of what you are saying they basically have told you guys to piss off, now guys do me a favour read the tread from start to finish and my posts would have told you this, now all you people want to work this out in clear and even manner start listening,stop acting like amataurs there is no point in contacting them until they are in breach of contract and this does not happen for another month,firstly we need to take the disscussion private if anyone among the posters are into computers please contact me and we will get this set up, to the few people who has pm me knows i have the wheels in motion, i would like some support and stop contacting eurosilex it will get you nowhere ,dannyo

 

[livenow]

Hi Dannyo
i agree some part of the discussion needs to be taken private. But we need to keep this thread alive so that more and more eurosilex investors find it out in google search..
I am still not able to PM you..

Maybe as i said- it will be good to arrange a meeting in UK , either in london or somewhere convinient for majority..,

 

[dannyo]

HI
Im not suggesting we stop posting here, but we need to control who reads what we are going to do so guys who has the knowledge to set up the private forum, we have a lot to do so guys lets get going dannyo

 

[yam600]

how can we be sure that the banks are actually insisting on Eurosilex obtaining this clause from clients ? It doesnt feel correct to me. More like Eurosilex trying to somehow get us to give up our claims in case of non performance of contract.
Maybe they should invite us investors to the meeting with their banks

This new contract is to protect the project from going down. Think carefully, its nearly built, if you pull out now it could stop the thing getting built.

Stop posting personal feeling and think clearly, waiting another 12 months is nothing compared to years of lawsuits.

If this project stops, then all the others will follow suit. It is the credit market forcing the issue. All business rely on loans to keep going.

Yam600 01617471234

 

[livenow]

Dear Yam
I am thinking very clearly and i thought this forum is to post our personal views !!!
I would have been more confident had their letter been more detailed on which banks they are in discussions with. Just sending a letter asking to change the terms and specifically give up all claims on any damages is not correct in my opinion..
What is the guarantee that they will build it in a year's time once they have the contract from us ?

 

[dannyo]

hi
yam you are taking a very simplistic view of this whole saga do you really believe that the credit crunch has anything to do with this other than it stopped the flow of new investors purchasing later developments this has stopped eurosilex nothing else, now let me explain another thing to you,we all paid about 1000 euro per sq metre for our properties but construction costs would be at most 200 euros per sq metre including site costs so can you guys do the maths on this and give me an answer where you think this other money is and here a hint, offshore bank account, now guys focus on the issues of how to move forward with us all discussing how to go forward, a secure platform to chat, may i suggest skype and we can have a conference call to get moving,i would also point out that this involves more than golden valley some of the crystal spas people need to get involed in this it effects you guys too. danno

 

[Tidalflow]

Forum polarizing in the response to Eurosilex Letter

hi
yam you are taking a very simplistic view of this whole saga do you really believe that the credit crunch has anything to do with this other than it stopped the flow of new investors purchasing later developments this has stopped eurosilex nothing else, now let me explain another thing to you,we all paid about 1000 euro per sq metre for our properties but construction costs would be at most 200 euros per sq metre including site costs so can you guys do the maths on this and give me an answer where you think this other money is and here a hint, offshore bank account, now guys focus on the issues of how to move forward with us all discussing how to go forward, a secure platform to chat, may i suggest skype and we can have a conference call to get moving,i would also point out that this involves more than golden valley some of the crystal spas people need to get involed in this it effects you guys too. danno

Hi Dannyo,
Although your estimate of the difference between selling price/sq metre and construction costs/sq metre may well be true clearly it does not follow this represents the profit Eurosilex made. Are you not forgetting the whole running costs of their business including advertising, offices, design, IT, property shows, travel etc. Then consider good salaries for their successful sales staff and better still for others higher up the chain in the good years leading up to this decline in sales?
It would seem that we already have both the hawks and doves in this forum, which suggests it is going to be harder for us all to find a common direction over the next few weeks.

Regards,

Tidalflow

 

[dannyo]

hi tidalflow
great whats there expences got to do with anything let me make it quite clear i know the correct way to move forward i have tried to explain to the people who are sitting on the fence how it works from what i can see most of you have not a clue whats going on and in two years time you still will not know, you seem to be very keen on explaining how eurosilex works, and their position now if you want to swallow their line of crap , be my guest but im not and from the way the posts are going you all want to do nothing .im going forward with or without you and the few people that has pm me ill let you know whats happening and for the rest stay sitting on that fence it must be comfortable to watch eurosilex make monkeys out of you, dannyo

 

[sjioverseas]

Hello all, can you tell me if anyone is signing this annex proposed by eurosilex?

 

[joyisaac]

Proper Agreement

Before giving any contract to any vendor one should be able to put all aspect of work in black and white otherwise it will end up in mess. As per my experience it will be difficult to believe anyone now a days as values have changed and motive has become ammassing money. So proper agreements are to be made including all aspects of work and a clause of exit when you assign sombodey for your project.

 

[livenow]

i am not signing the contract. Cannot trust a developer who wants to take my legal rights in case of non performance of the contract

 

[sjioverseas]

agreed, i have sent the developer an email today to that effect and will expect a reply will let all know the response. I also intend to have the financials checked out and see how messed up this situation really is

 

[dannyo]

hi all
now we are moving i am delighted we are all starting to move in the same direction,my feeling is nobody sign the contracts until further notice. the private forum is not set up,since nobody has any better ideas maybe all interested set up on skype and ill pm my details and we will get the ball rolling. dannyo

 

[sjioverseas]

Dannyo, how many eurosilex buyers have found this forum? any idea

 

[dannyo]

hi
not sure i think 10 or 12 im just trying to get people to think sensibly first

 

[SPview]

Legal representation

I am not advertising or trying to do anything untoward - (I know a lot of people who suggest advice can get shot down in flames on these forums!)

But in my own experience, both personally and professionally - the best course of action to ensure you are completely protected and know what you are doing is to engage the serives of a reputable Lawyer. I admire the fact the people are trying to help each other out with all the problems that are surfacing - but at the end of the day you have to be careful - and make sure you arent just second guessing and summising - and taking advice (with all due respect) from people who have no legal background or genuine knowledge of the processes and contracts in Bulgaria.

As I said Im not advertising so as not to "taint" my post - but give me a shout if you need a recommendation - someone I have used for my purchases in Brazil and in Bulgaria.

Best of luck with everything.

 

[dannyo]

hi spview
thank you for your kind offer but i have not said here in an open forum what our course of action is but for those who have contacted me privately i do explain and will to others, again i have no plan to lead this other than on sound legal advice and lets put it another way they train is about to leave the station on that one many thanks for your offer of help dannyo, are you an investor here as well.

 

[SPview]

Hi Dannyo - thanks for your response.

Im not an investor on this development, although I have purchased in other developments in Bulgaria (also Brazil). One Bulgaria property completed no problem whatsoever - all good. One was a real struggle - and is still not sorted 100%.

The point I was making related to the fact that I got things sorted by using the Lawyers who I used when things all went smoothly - and they helped me with the one that didnt go so smooth!! But I didnt want it to come across that I was promoting a particular Law Firm - just that I know how important it is to get proper advice! For some people this is all their savings tied up in these properties and its frightening! at least with someone professional you feel safer (as safe as you can be anyway).

Sadly although I find these forums really useful and supportive - they can also end up creating havoc when you have peoples opinion and "knowledge" being given - when in fact they have no real knowledge at all - and it can make bad things even worse. I m glad you are getting together Dannyo with the other investors, and I hope you are one of the good guys who will make sure people protect themselves and do things the right way.

 

[Jain and Chris]

Hello all

I think this is a very difficult situation for everyone - buyer and developer alike. It is not unique to Bulgaria either, I just heard this afternoon from someone in Dubai with exactly the same problems. Plus Egypt, Morocco and other countries are all experiencing the same.

I agree with SPview, it is imperative that each of you seek independent professional legal advice. Fora are great for sharing things but relying on someone's opinion to make a legal decision, when you don't even know who that person is let alone whether they have the correct background to give you adive, is highly dangerous. Share all the information you can but get your own lawyer acting in your sole interest.

It is all going to be difficult to sort out but my gut reaction is that even if you take the developer to court it will be a long-winded and expensive process. Plus, if at the end of the day, you do get a decision in your favour, it is likely that the developer is a Bulgarian limited company and you would be unlikely to get your money back anyway. There is no point in taking anyone to court for financial recompense if they do not have the means to pay you.

The contract put forward by the developer is the opening start of negotiations with all the buyers. There may be changes in the contract to come... it all depends upon how the buyers react and what you can negotiate. Going in too hard, will only force the developer to abandon, which may not be in your best interests. Negotiation will be paramount here.

Amassing money was probably the point of most buyers too (not only the developer). I think actually now, amassing money is out of the mind of any sane person - it is tin hats on, hunker down and protect for the long-term, which are more the values of today in this current financial climate.

Dannyo, yes buyers may have bought at 1,000 euros / sq.m. but they didn't pay all that money upfront. They paid a percentage. All off plan works in this way, all across the world. The initial deposits are used to keep building to the next stage and so on. If no new buyers keep arriving to eventually purchase all the apartments / villas, then funds dry up for the developer, making completion very difficult, if not impossible. In your estimated building costs you do not add in the other costs which the developer incurrs as mentioned by tidalflow. Nor do you take into consideration infrastructure costs and how many of the total number of apartments have been sold.

Yam600 had a point - the project is nearly finished. Perhaps the delay may work in your favour? The pound exchange rate could well improve by that time and the development completed so you will get the property you wanted anyway?

I don't know the answer. It is a big thing to ponder but I would not be too rushed myself to take immediate legal action. I would weigh up the pros and cons for myself and then get independent legal advice from an honest and trustworthy Bulgarian lawyer. If anybody wishes, they can contact the lawyers who write for us. We have used them on many occasions, both for personal and business purposes, and we can personally vouch for them. They have also acted for visitors to our site and have saved them tens of thousands of pounds.

I wish you all well and hope that things work out for the best for each and everyone of you.

Best wishes