Advice on NE Brasil property market

[Neil T]

Thanks to everyone who replied to my questions. Very helpful - It seems that the consensus is that the property market in Brazil has not been affected much apart from some of the more expensive new developments aimed at overseas buyers. I am aiming to move out to Brazil over the next year so thanks very much for the advice!
Regards
Neil

 

[Brazilian Homes]

Move to Brazil

Hi Neil,

Good for you...moving to Brazil. Great move!!

Your conclusion is indeed correct. Imperative to be selective when investing in Brazil. Our main advice would simply be "if the Brazilians don´t buy in the area, why would you....?"

Good luck and welcome to Brazil,

 

[dhoskings]

Hi Neil,

Good for you...moving to Brazil. Great move!!

Your conclusion is indeed correct. Imperative to be selective when investing in Brazil. Our main advice would simply be "if the Brazilians don´t buy in the area, why would you....?"

Good luck and welcome to Brazil,

Weren't you promoting Touros as the next Pipa once?

 

[Brazilian Homes]

You must think of someone else as we have never marketed anything in Touros.

 

[dhoskings]

You must think of someone else as we have never marketed anything in Touros.

No it was a finnish guy, either you or the one who owns the company you work for. He used to work for a company in Spain and he was telling me about their project in Touros and with a straight face said Touros was going to be the next Pipa.

I thought that was pretty funny .

 

[dhoskings]

You must think of someone else as we have never marketed anything in Touros.

No it was a finnish guy, either you or the one who owns the company you work for. He used to work for a company in Spain, and he was telling me about their project in Touros and with a straight face said Touros was going to be the next Pipa.

I thought that was pretty funny.

 

[dhoskings]

You must think of someone else as we have never marketed anything in Touros.

since you are based in Brazil you must have a Creci, otherwise all your real estate transactions are illegal and not protected.

 

[Brazilian Homes]

Yes we are fully licensed in Brazil as every other Brazilian real estate agency.

 

[Sao P]

Whats your CRECI Number ??

 

[ana albor]

when you ppl are talking about not to trust when buying in Brazil...and you advice having an attorney ...how can you get one before travelling there? We are thinking to travel there in April...to rent a car and to travel around Western Ceara...Any suggestion , pls?

 

[JMBroad]

when you ppl are talking about not to trust when buying in Brazil...and you advice having an attorney ...how can you get one before travelling there? We are thinking to travel there in April...to rent a car and to travel around Western Ceara...Any suggestion , pls?

There are numerous law firms in Brazil who also have offices abroad - from memory people have mentioned Nabas Consultants (although who I have not worked with them personally),Manzanares International who I have worked with and Gadelha Consultores who I have also worked with before. There is even a gentleman who posts here on the forums who is a lawyer in Brazil.

Either of the above I'm sure you can find by "google" however if you want recommendation of who to talk to in either of the latter two I'll be happy to pass you some contact details.

With regards to what to check to know if a development is legal or not, the first step would be to request the "Registro de Memorial de Incorporaçao" if the developer can present that document, it means that the development can be legally sold in Brazil to Brazilians - aka that it has all of the licenses before that.

There are, like every country, a number of different checks which you need to do to make sure the development is legal (even if you have received a copy of the Registro) however that is a good first step. If you can't get that document, it's a good sign that you need to check a lot more before you commit.

Any particular reason you are only looking at Western Ceara? Generally speaking Brazil is in my humble opinion the place to invest at the moment - which part of Brazil all depends on what you are looking for - it all depends on your own personal taste and depends on what exactly you are looking for.

I'm personally partial to Rio Grande do Norte, so much so that after visiting quite a few other areas I decided to live and work here - depending who you ask here on the forums you'll get lots of different opinions - some may say Pipa (south of Natal),some will say Eastern or Western Ceara, others will say Maceio, others Itamarca or Bahia. Each has something special to offer.

 

[ana albor]

JM..Thank you for your response and information. We are starting our property search in Cumbuco and Lagoinha Beach. No particular reason other than my husband and I feel the Northeast has the best potential and not as crowded in our opinion. The only thing we are concerned about is too much wind. We do not want the big city life but we want to be close. We are very serious potential buyers. Any insights and information you may have would be appreciated. Best regards..

 

[JMBroad]

JM..Thank you for your response and information. We are starting our property search in Cumbuco and Lagoinha Beach. No particular reason other than my husband and I feel the Northeast has the best potential and not as crowded in our opinion. The only thing we are concerned about is too much wind. We do not want the big city life but we want to be close. We are very serious potential buyers. Any insights and information you may have would be appreciated. Best regards..

There is a wealth of information on these boards, you can find a lot of good, reliable information here - try a search on "Cumbuco" for example and you'll find some posts about developments in that area which may be of help. Other than that - I work in real estate out here in Brazil but as I said, based in Natal, Rio Grande do Norte. I've been to Fortaleza, Ceará a couple of times - it is quite different to Natal, but they both have a lot to offer.

While in Ceará you mentioned you were going to go East - towards Cumbuco and Lagoinha - that is of course the less developed area - there is a very different feel if you go East or West - most people who work in real estate in Ceará would probably say that the West holds more potential benefits - the East has a lot of fantastic beach bars and beach restaurants - the west has more growth potential.

Before coming over to work in Natal I was a researcher and analyst for a large real estate agency in Europe - my job was to report back on emerging markets and the residential real estate developments in the countries I was responsible for and carry out the Due Diligence checks on the developments in coordination with a legal team. As such I've seen countless developments west of Ceará and a couple to the East and some within Fortaleza itself.

As with any overseas purchase, your main concern should be that the development is legal and will be completed as described. As such the document you'll want to ask for (which the developer legally has to have to sell the development in Brazil) is the "Registro de Memorial de Incorporaçao".

This document not only states who the developer is, exactly where the plot of land is located, it's borders, what the developer is going to build on that piece of land (each unit described in detail). But most importantly, it is a sign that the previous licenses environmental licenses, building license, etc are in place.

While seeing that document is in itself no guarantee, the absence of that document is a sign that further research needs to be done. There can be reasons why the developer does not have one - the development may be in the planning stages, the developer may have submitted the request for it, or the developer may be in a pre-launch phase... So it's not a black or white answer, but it's a good indication of how far along the development is. (without seeing construction of course)

 

[robh]

JM..Thank you for your response and information. We are starting our property search in Cumbuco and Lagoinha Beach. No particular reason other than my husband and I feel the Northeast has the best potential and not as crowded in our opinion. The only thing we are concerned about is too much wind. We do not want the big city life but we want to be close. We are very serious potential buyers. Any insights and information you may have would be appreciated. Best regards..

if you don't like too much wind then you had better look very carefully in west Ceará as it is a famous wind/kite surfing area.

 

[Brazilian Homes]

JM..Thank you for your response and information. We are starting our property search in Cumbuco and Lagoinha Beach. No particular reason other than my husband and I feel the Northeast has the best potential and not as crowded in our opinion. The only thing we are concerned about is too much wind. We do not want the big city life but we want to be close. We are very serious potential buyers. Any insights and information you may have would be appreciated. Best regards..

Hi Ana Albor,

I think what you say is very sensible, a bit out of the city but still close by. It buys you more property for the money, and usually provides for a more relaxed lifestyle as well.

JM Broads advice is very good. The first step is always to ask for the "registro de incorporação" but I would rather use an independent lawyer instead of you trying to make sense of Brazilian legal documents; that way you are always protected. There is so much more than the legal licenses themselves that a lawyer will check (pending court cases etc. that won´t show up in any license paperwork).

I would not be too concerned about too much wind in Fortaleza. For sure, kite surfers love the area, but kite surfing is good in the entire northeastern Brazil, not only in Fortaleza. The wind here is not too strong and it actually makes the temperature feel even nicer. Parts of the year it can get a bit stronger, but don´t worry about it. Who knows, maybe you even start kite surfing yourself.....?

Sounds like you are more of a lifestyle buyer. My advice is to drive around and get a feel of the areas. You will find that the farther away you go from the city (whether Fortaleza, Natal or any other city) the less "action" there is. Some areas might seem nice during the weekend and can be pretty much ghost towns during the week.

Fortaleza has some nice small coastal towns. Personally I prefer Natal and the small villages here, but that is my personal taste.

Good luck in your research.

 

[JMBroad]

Oh absolutely hire an independent lawyer to do all the checks - but things will go a lot smoother and faster if you can hand your lawyer at least the Incorporation number.

 

[Sao P]

You have to wonder why Brazilian Homes don't show it on their website???

Maybe they dont show thier CRECI # on thier website, as they should, because they dont have one. maybe.

 

[PeteZTrucker]

Neil; had a drink with a local real estate agent last night.
Answers to your questions;
1 Downturn has had no discernible effect here in Maceio.
2 Prices are going up, but not by much, only Italians are buying, and they generally buy in Italian-owned and financed condominiums.
3 No, prices are not inflated for foreign buyers, as far as he knows.
4 Most buyers here are Brazilian, and therefore knowledgeable about buying and selling property. Never had any problems myself, or heard of any.
5 He said he knew a simple but pleasant beach house, 1o0m back from the beach in Paripuera, 25kms north of Maceio, for 40,000R. We´ve bought land in a new condo, Atlantis, 730sqm, for 143,000R, great view, a luxury (unfinished but well advanced) development. There are still some plots left for around 100,000R. No idea if that is comparable to elsewhere in the NE.

 

[PAUL-brasil]

JM..Thank you for your response and information. We are starting our property search in Cumbuco and Lagoinha Beach. No particular reason other than my husband and I feel the Northeast has the best potential and not as crowded in our opinion. The only thing we are concerned about is too much wind. We do not want the big city life but we want to be close. We are very serious potential buyers. Any insights and information you may have would be appreciated. Best regards..

Hello Ana albor,

I live and work here in Tabuba (the town just before you come to Cumbuco),we love it here, beautiful surrounding area, spacious and quiet, but with basic conveinent infrastructer around (food shops, a couple of restuarants, barracs etc),cheaper than cumbuco, and only 20KM to the city. With the extra choice of the gringo town of cumbuco or the bigger town of Icarai for a wider choice of restuarants and amenities etc just 5 mins in either direction.

Best regards

 

[ana albor]

Thank you

Hello Ana albor,

I live and work here in Tabuba (the town just before you come to Cumbuco),we love it here, beautiful surrounding area, spacious and quiet, but with basic conveinent infrastructer around (food shops, a couple of restuarants, barracs etc),cheaper than cumbuco, and only 20KM to the city. With the extra choice of the gringo town of cumbuco or the bigger town of Icarai for a wider choice of restuarants and amenities etc just 5 mins in either direction.

Best regards

Thank you very much Paul for your answer, we will consider Tabuba also in our trip. Do you have any suggestion on your area to visit? We are not thinking to live there yet. We have thought that it would be safer to have a plot or a condo due to we will be travelling 2 or 3 times per year. Thank you very much!